4L60e/65e/70e stats from GM Powertrain

M30=4l60e 360 lb/ft max. torque rating 610 lb/ft max. gearbox torque rating
M32=4l65e 400 lb/ft max. torque rating 670 lb/ft max. gearbox torque rating
M70=4l70e 400 lb/ft max. torque rating 670 lb/ft max. gearbox torque rating


Hydra-Matic 4L60-E/4L65-E Transmission
(M30/M32/M33/M70/MD6/MK2)
Type: four speed rear-wheel-drive, electronically
controlled, automatic overdrive transmission
with torque converter clutch
2.8L - 5.7L (M30)
6.0L (M32/M70)
360 lb-ft (488 Nm) (M30)
400 lb-ft (542 Nm) (M32/M70)
610 lb-ft (827 Nm) (M30)
670 lb-ft (910 Nm) (M32/M70)
Gear ratios:
First: 3.06
Second: 1.63
Third: 1
Fourth: 0.7
Reverse: 2.29
1-2 6200 rpm
2-3 6100 rpm
3-4 n/a
Maximum shift speed (M32): 1-2 6400 rpm
2-3 6200 rpm
3-4 n/a
1-2 6400 rpm
2-3 6200 rpm
3-4 n/a
Maximum validated gross vehicle weight: up to 8600 lb (3900 kg) (application & axle
ratio dependent)
P, R, N, OD, D, 2, 1
P, R, N, OD, 3, 2, 1
Case material: die cast aluminum
Shift pattern: (2) two-way on/off solenoids
Shift quality: variable bleed solenoid
Torque converter clutch: pulse width modulated solenoid control
245, 258, 280, 300mm (M30) (diameter of
torque converter turbine)
300mm (M32)
Fluid type: DEXRON VI
wet: 74 kg (163.2 lb) (M30)
wet: 88.3 kg (194.6 lb) (M32/M70)
7.9L (8.4 qt) (245-mm converter)
10.8L (11.4 qt) (300-mm converter)
Pressure taps available: line pressure
Toledo, Ohio
Romulus, Mich.
Ramos Arizpe, Mexico
Chevrolet Colorado/GMC Canyon (M30)
Chevrolet TrailBlazer SS (M30/M70)
Chevrolet TrailBlazer/Buick Rainier (M30)
Chevrolet Silverado 1500-2500/GMC Sierra
1500-2500 (M30, M32, Hybrid (PHT)M33,
M70)
Chevrolet Tahoe/GMC Yukon (M30/M32)
Cadillac Escalade/Escalade EXT (M32)
Chevrolet Avalanche (M30)
Chevrolet Suburban (M30)
Chevrolet Express and GMC Savana (M30)
Chevrolet SSR (M32)
GMC Sierra Denali (M32)
GMC Yukon XL Denali (M30, M32)
HUMMER H2 (M32)
HUMMER H2 SUT (M32)
HUMMER H3 (M30)
Pontiac GTO (M32)
Envoy Denali (M30)
Saab 9--7(M30)

4l80e/4l85e trans stats also from GM powertrain

MN1=4l80e max torque rating 440lb/ft torque
MN8=4l85e max torque rating 460 lb/ft torque

2006 Hydra-Matic 4L80-E/4L85-E
Transmission (MT1/MN8)
Type: four speed rear-wheel-drive, electronically
controlled, automatic overdrive transmission
with torque converter clutch
4.3L - 8.1L gasoline
6.5L - 6.6L diesel
440 lb-ft (597 Nm) (MT1)
460 lb-ft (624 Nm) (MN8)
Maximum gearbox torque: 885 lb-ft (1200 Nm)
Gear ratios:
First: 2.48
Second: 1.48
Third: 1
Fourth: 0.75
Reverse: 2.07
1-2 5200 rpm
2-3 5200 rpm
3-4 5200 rpm
Maximum validated gross vehicle weight: up to 18,000 lb (8165 kg) (application & axle
ratio dependent)
7-position quadrant: P, R, N, OD, D, 2, 1
Case material: die cast aluminum
Shift pattern: (2) two-way on/off solenoids
Shift quality: force motor control
Torque converter clutch: pulse width modulated solenoid control
Converter size: 310mm (reference) (diameter of torque
converter turbine)
Fluid type: DEXRON VI
wet: 115 kg (254 lb) (MT1)
wet: 115.5 kg (255 lb) (MN8)
Fluid capacity (approximate): bottom pan removal: 4L - 6L (4.2 qt - 6.3 qt)
Pressure taps available: line pressure
Towing capacity: up to 22,000 lb (9979 kg) maximum gross
combined vehicle weight (application & axle
ratio dependent)
Assembly sites: Ypsilanti, Mich.
Chevrolet Avalanche (MN8)
Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra
2500HD & 3500 series (MT1)
Chevrolet Suburban and GMC Yukon XL
(MT1/MN8)
Chevrolet Express and GMC Savana
(MT1/MN8)
Hummer H1 (MT1)
C 3500 HD (MT1)
W Series (MT1)


I noticed that the 4l65e70e weighs 195 lbs wet which is 32 lbs heavier than the 4l60e trans which weighs 163 lbs.

Seeing that the 65e/70e weighs 195 lbs wet and the 4l80e/85e weighs 254/255 lbs respectivley, the difference between the heavier trans and teh lighter duty trans is only 60 lbs.

I used to think that the 80e was MUCH heavier than the 60e series trans but it really isnt, the 80e has closer gear ratios than the 60e

60e 3.06:1 1st gear 1.63:1 2nd gear 1:1 3rd 0.70:1 OD
80e 2.48: 1st gear 1.48:1 2nd gear 1:1 3rd and 0.75:1 OD gearing.

In the f-body world, peple who remove the 700/4l60e/65e transmissions and switch to the th 350 which has 2.52:1 1st and 1.52:1 2nd gear and 1:1 3rd gear, they usually reduce their 1/4 mile time by 3-4 tenths, just from the trans alone, no other change in tune whatsoever. This leads me to beleive that the improvement in ET is from the closer gearratios of the th 350 compared top the 4 speed OD auto gearing. The closer th 350 ratios help keep the engine in its power band better, but not have such a large drop in rpms at the shifts.

Now seeing that the 4l80e has VERY similar 1st 2nd and 3rd gear gearing, if the 4l80e had the same effeciency as a th-350 a vehicle should see the same gains. The 80e doesnt have the same effeceincy as the th-350, 700r4 r the 4l60e series of transmissions, but the improved gear ratios of teh 80e should at least offset the losses due to its increased mass over the 1/2 ton transmissions, and maybe even take a chunk off of the losses due to the losses due to the 80e's decreased effeciency.

So maybe I can say that a swap from a 4l60e to a 4l80e would be close at the very least. Maybe a tenth or 2 in the 1/4 mile for a much more relieable and strong transmission is worth it in my opinion.

FLP sells its Level 5 4l60e trans for $2850US and its Level 5 4l80e trans (same 1 that Parish is runnin 10.0's with in his RCSB single turbo 408 with 1100 rwhp and 1050 rwtq) for $3600US.

Its less expensive Level 4 4l60e $1995US for cars under 550rwhp and its less expensive advertised
Level 4 4l80e trans is $2150US and say they are using it reliably in 11 secong fullsize trucks.

Considering that a rebuild is quite expensive, in my mind it makes sense to spend the extra $750US for the top of the line Level 5 trans or the extra $155US for the less built Level 4 transmissions.

I realize that there will be an added expense to add a 4l80e trans to a truck that was originally equipped with the 60e series trans, but even if the 60e breaks once, if you had went with the 80e in the 1st place, you for sure would have saved money.

During the Month of January all transmissions are 15% off
Level 4 4l80e was $1995US now is $1695.75US
Level 5 4l80e was $3600US now is $3060.00US

Level 4 4l60e was $1995US now is $1695.75US
Level 5 4l65e was $2850US now is $2422.50US

Performance T-56 for F-bodies (or GMT800 LS? based engine or GMT400 GEN 1 or GEN 1-E Vortec based engines)
was $1950 now is $1657.50

Extreme T-56 "Dodge Viper Spec" T-56 with ALL the goodies, fitment for F-bodies ( or the GMT800 use a LS1 based trans or teh GMT400 use a LT1 based T-56)
was $2550US now is $2167.50US.

Here is the FLP or Finish Line Performance website, https://www.flp2win.com/store/.

Here is the actual transmission page.
http://www.flp2win.com/cart/transmission.php

I have heard that the owner of this shop actually want people to break his products, so he can find ways to make stuff stronger. I have heard comments like "He actually want to make your truck faster", " I brought him my broken trans, he smiled and immediatley torn into thetrans to see what let go, he ended up installing a cryo-treated shaft, it hasnt broken since". "the owner is a true Hotrodder, he takes an interest in your vehicle".

I may be checking out FLP in the future.

peace
Hog

Here is some more info on the new 4l70e trans as well as info on the 4l65e and 4l60e, from GM powertrain.

HYDRA-MATIC 4L60-E / 4L65-E / 4L70-E (M30 / M32 / M33 / MD6 / MK2 /M70) CAR AND
TRUCK TRANSMISSIONS2006 model year summary
● Gearset and output shaft strengthened for new high-output applications (M70)
● Internal input speed sensor added
● DEXRON® VI premium fluid validated to improve durability and shift stability
● New applications in HUMMER H3 and Saab 9-7x
● Hexavalent chrome coatings eliminated

Full descriptions of new or changed features

Gearset and output shaft strengthened for new heavy duty 4L70-E (M70)
To meet the high-output requirements for the new Chevrolet Trailblazer SS 6.0-liter LS2 V-8, the output shaft and the steel reaction gear have been strengthened using a combination of
stronger steel and processing of the steel through additional heat-treating and tempering.

Internal input speed sensor added

To allow more sophisticated electronic programming of shifting and other transmission
functions, an internal input speed sensor was added to precisely monitor the input shaft speed.
To fit the sensor inside the transmission without changing major components or the
transmission case, the sensor is installed inside the fluid pump. The input shaft is then splined
where the sensor can count the splines.

DEXRON® VI premium fluid validated to improve durability and shift stability
A new transmission fluid, DEXRON® VI, was developed to have a more consistent viscosity
profile; a more consistent shift performance in extreme conditions; and less degredation over
time. Internal GM tests have demonstrated DEXRON® VI to deliver more than twice the
durability and stability in friction tests compared to existing fluids. This fluid is validated and
required in all 2006 4L60-E/4L65-E/4L70-E transmissions.

New application in 2006 Hummer H3 and Saab 9-7x
Because of the new input speed sensor, the 4L60-E is able to be tuned to match the brand
character of the new midsize rugged HUMMER H3 and the uplevel European luxury Saab 9-7x.
Tuning for the Saab includes earlier downshifting to enhance performance.
Low maintenance

For severe use, DEXRON® VI fluid changes are the only maintenance recommended. For
normal use there is no fluid change scheduled. Continual development of the 4L60-E/4L65-
E/4L70-E to increase high-mileage longevity remains a priority.
Another contribution to low maintenance is the ability to match the transmissions to each of its
broad list of applications. Performance efficiency and ideal cooling are achieved by using one of five sizes of torque converters, and that contributes to long-term durability.


Overview

The Hydra-Matic 4L60-E / 4L65-E are differentiated primarily because of gearset design. Each
of the two planetary gearsets in these four-speed automatic transmissions have four pinion
gears in the 4L60-E, and five pinion gears in the 4L65-E. The 4L65-E was introduced in the
2001 model year as a heavy-duty (HD) variant with more robust parts that provide increased
strength. Beginning in 2002, many of the technologies from the 4L65-E applications that add
durability have been incorporated into the 4L60-E, such as more robust bushings and bearings.
The 4L70-E is new a variation of the five-pinion 4L65-E, with additional strengthening in the
output shaft and reaction gear to handle increased engine torque.
The Hydra-Matic 4L60-E / 4L65-E / 4L70-E are also characterized by rigid structures and low
noise designs. These transmissions are state-of-the-art for rear-drive and four-wheel drive cars and trucks because of their adaptive shift electronic controls and GM’s proprietary Electronic Controlled Capacity Clutch (ECCC) technology. The ECCC allows sophisticated variable clutch slip to dampen engine pulses, providing smooth shifting and driveline feel. The transmissions also take directions from vehicle powertrain control modules to avoid hunting between gears when climbing hills. On certain applications, the new T42 transmission control module is used, which allows sophisticated software control of the transmission.
An extremely versatile transmission, the 4L60-E / 4L65-E / 4L70-E functions in a wide range of
applications. Sophisticated electronic controls and high-torque capabilities allow it to serve in
the high-performance Pontiac GTO as well as pickups and SUVs ranging from the compact
Chevrolet Canyon and GMC Colorado pickup trucks to the roomy GMC Yukon XL.
The gearset bushings are Teflon coated to add durability for very high-speed operation, making it ideal for vehicles like the GTO or TrailBlazer SS.

The 4L60-E/4L65-E/4L70-E are produced in three plants, Toledo, Ohio; Romulus, Mich.; and
Ramos Arizpe, Mexico. Both the newer Romulus and Ramos Arizpe plants have state-of-the-art
gear processing systems, and similar systems have now been upgraded at the Toledo plant,
which has been building transmissions since 1982.

For four-wheel drive applications on the Canyon and Colorado, the bottom pan of the 4L60-E
was modified so that the prop shaft from the transfer case to the front differential can clear the
side of the transmission. As a result of the new bottom pan, the 1-2 accumulator housing, the
valve body, and the fluid filter had to be redesigned for clearance. The fluid filter, which is
housed inside the bottom pan of the transmission, was also redesigned to fit the new pan.
The 4L60-E (M33) is also used with the Chevy Silverado and GMC Sierra hybrids, which uses
an electric motor/alternator sandwiched between the conventional engine and transmission. The electric motor assists the engine during acceleration, and generates electricity to charge
batteries at other times. The torque converter is a 258 mm unit, but it is modified to take the
extra torque of the V-8 engine. The input shaft on the torque converter is stronger, and the
lockup clutch is a more robust dual-plate design. Generally V-8 engines are matched to 300 mm torque converters, but the smaller unit was used to allow space for the electric motor. The
torque converter for Hummer H2 SUT is specially tuned to produce slightly more torque
multiplication initially, for quicker vehicle acceleration.

Four-wheel drive options

The 4L60-E is mated to several different transfer cases used by four-wheel drive applications.
The Colorado and Canyon use either the New Venture model 233 or 236. The 233 is a part-timeconventional transfer case, but engages through an electrically operated solenoid. The 236 can be used full time, with an electrically operated clutch pack engaging the front wheels when rear wheel slippage is detected. The Silverado and Sierra use the New Venture models 246, 261,the Borg Warner 4482 and T150. The 246 has an electrically operated clutch pack to send torque to the front axle, and the 261 is a conventional part-time transfer case.
The 4L65-E is mated to 3 different transfer cases used by four-wheel drive applications. The
New Venture 149 is used in the Yukon and Tahoe and contains a center differential for full-time
use. A Borg Warner 4481 is used by the heavy-duty Silverado and Sierra pickups, and a Borg
Warner 4484 is used by the Hummer H2.

OK now the 4l80e and 4l85e trans

HYDRA-MATIC 4L80-E / 4L85-E (MT1 / MN8)
2006 model year summary
• Roller clutch and new torque converter for new application in Chevy Express and
GMC Savana with 6.6-liter Duramax V-8.
• DEXRON® VI premium fluid validated to improve durability and shift stability

Full descriptions of new or changed features

Roller clutch and new torque converter for new application in Chevy Express and GMC
Savana with 6.6-liter Duramax V-8
To increase durability for a new application of the 6.6-liter Duramax diesel V-8 in the Express
and Savana full-size vans, the roller clutch was changed to a unit that would handle more torque at lower engine speeds. This roller clutch had been previously developed for the 4L85-E in 2002. In addition, a new torque converter with characteristics optimized for the diesel application was developed for this application as well.
DEXRON® VI premium fluid validated to improve durability and shift stability
A new transmission fluid, DEXRON® VI, was developed to have a more consistent viscosity
profile; a more consistent shift performance in extreme conditions; and less degredation over
time. Internal GM tests have demonstrated DEXRON® VI to deliver more than twice the
durability and stability in friction tests compared to existing fluids. This fluid is validated and
required in all 2006 4L80-E / 4L85-E transmissions.

Low maintenance

The only maintenance necessary consists of fluid changes at differing duty cycles depending
upon how rigorous the transmission is used in its application. MT1 / MN8 use the new
DEXRON® VI automatic transmission fluid.

Overview

The Hydra-Matic 4L80-E and 4L85-E are close-ratio four-speed automatic transmissions that
serve the heavy duty truck market, full-size vans, as well as school buses and motor home
chassis. The Hummer H1 also uses the 4L80-E. The 4L85-E was added as a heavier duty
version of the 4L80-E for the 2002 model year. The 4L85-E has heavy duty components to
handle increased torque and horsepower requirements. Those components include 5-pinion
output and reaction gearsets. Within these gearset carrier assemblies, the smallest gears are
the pinions that revolve around the sun gears. Four-pinion gearsets are sufficient, but adding a
pinion gear to the gearsets allows them to handle higher loads.
The transmissions incorporate electronic controls that utilize the powertrain control module
(PCM) to provide consistent and precise shift points and shift quality. These controls
continuously monitor shift timing, internal and external conditions, and adjust shifts for
consistency. Because the vehicle applications often include trailering, the shift pattern can be
selected by the driver to operate more smoothly when towing. Likewise, shift stabilization limits
the amount of hunting between gears when traveling through mountains, with or without a
trailer.
Continual model year improvements have been made to increase reliability.

Four-wheel drive options

The 4L80-E can be mated to three models of New Venture transfer cases. Model 246 features
an electrically operated clutch pack that directs torque to the front axle when slippage in the rear wheels is detected, and can be used full-time. Model 261 is a conventional part-time transfer case, while model 263 is part-time but is engaged by an electric solenoid. The 4L85-E can be mated to the model 246 transfer case.

some interesting stuff here, enjoy.

peace
Hog

Hog you got this info for the 350/400 and 200/700r4 trannies?
Or a link to difference's between a 2wd/4wd. or between the 700r4 and 4l60e?

whoa, nice info

I wish OD was like .6 or .55 in my car so I could go up to 4.10 rear or so with out much change. Stock first with 3.15s is pretty doggy, and OD is running ~2200 at 75ish.

azzhauler wrote:

I wish OD was like .6 or .55 in my car so I could go up to 4.10 rear or so with out much change. Stock first with 3.15s is pretty doggy, and OD is running ~2200 at 75ish.

In a year, maybe less (maybe already) you can get the 6L80E. Instead of a super low OD with 4.10s you will be able to run 3.23s or 3.08s and have the acceleration of the 4.10s on a 4x trans. The first gear on the 6L80E is supposed to be 6.xx (too busy to look up).

It would take me 2 days to type all that!

the_new_guy wrote:

whoa, nice info

That's why you alway's search for your info before you post.
Hog posted this over a year ago,if I was him I would hate to repost it just cause someone couldn't do a search.

I'm sure if they made a 6l80 that fit the transaxle in the c5 it would cost waaaaay more than my wallet would touch. That tax is killer. If things work out well on a truck turbo for me I may try one on the car. $8k kit, no thanks.

The 6L80E is also supposed to make its way into the new SUVs, which means a 2WD and 4WD setup in the conventional location. I'd love to do a C5 transaxle myself, but find myself sitting next to you rowing the same boat. Course if gas keeps going like it is, making a 6 speed swap may be doable as it may save enough gas to pay for itself in a month or two instead of a year or two as it is now.

How long would a corvette transaxle last in our truck's with all our weight?
I've seen some 1/2 ton transaxle swap's,but they were on RCSB truck's and complete swap's from the radiator to the rim's.
I'll be lucky if I can just find a 4l80 from a 4wd to swap in mine,I'm just gonna stay stock till I find one.

I don't really see an issue with the Vette transaxle holding up under a truck, would have the same issues anything else would. Run too much power through it and it'll break, and the amount of power you can run through goes down with the weight moved. I'm pretty sure there are upgrades that can be applied to the unit to allow more power.

I'm referring mostly to our heavier truck's,like my yukon's and the ext cab's.
I'm of the firm belief that the 4l60 doesn't last because it has to move so much weight with the given amount of power.
I've noticed I go through trannies more in my yukon's compared to my ext cab's,but then again I have friend's with camaro's that are on their 3rd tranny this year(2 of them) so who know's.They don't even have much power,and I might have been pushing around 300 on any of mine.

The 4L60 is crap all the way around. The 700R4 is far more reliable than it is. Weak POS. I went through three performance builds on my 96 2 door 2WD Tahoe before I got one that was halfway decent (which also means it was halfway crap) at stock power levels of 210HP and 270TQ at the rear wheels, and weighing 4640lbs with a full tank in full running trim, no passengers. Not the same thing as the 6 speeds, which are supposed to be as strong and the same size as a 4L80E.

Just thinking out loud here, but from looking at fbody and vvette tunes on the 411 pcm, it has support for up to 8 forward gears. So *maybe* if the 6L80E comes easily adaptable to replace the 4L60E, the pcm at least should be able to handle it.

Yeah,I remember seeing up to 8 gear's on some of the ECM's.
I first noticed it on the 8.1 file actually,it had an allison and I thought that was why but the ecm doesn't control the allison.

Hog,any chance you do have that info for the 350/400 and 200/700 tranny's?